Why painful calls become powerful strategy - Dan Hodges, Conscious
Episode 11 - THAT MOMENT
What happens when you've been the client avoiding account management calls because they're painful, then you join the agency and find yourself delivering the exact same calls you used to dread? Most people would defend the system. Dan Hodges changed it completely.
Over 11 years at Conscious, Dan has watched the company double in size and completely transform what they do. But the transformation didn't start with strategy decks or consultant recommendations. It started with a memory. Back in 2009, as a business consultant doing strategic planning for a law firm, Dan experienced the soul-crushing account management call: stats dump, screen share showing invoices are up to date, perfunctory question about buying more services, call ends. Zero value. Pure transaction.
Fast forward five years. Dan joins Conscious as Head of Marketing, a digital agency serving law firms. Marketing services represents 3% of turnover. There's one SEO person doing "a bit of SEO and a bit of social media." Dan admits he didn't understand digital, couldn't even explain what SEO stood for. But he understood something more valuable: he'd been on the receiving end of terrible client service, and he wasn't going to perpetuate it.
When Dan started sitting in on account management calls, he recognised the pattern immediately. Same structure. Same lack of curiosity. Same transactional energy. The calls lasted 20 minutes, ticked boxes, went nowhere. So Dan asked a different question: "What do you want to achieve?" And everything changed. Those 20-minute calls became 40 minutes. Then 90 minutes. Sometimes two hours, much to account managers' frustration. Because Dan wasn't selling services, he was getting under the skin of the client's business, understanding not just what they needed but why they needed it.
This episode tackles the tension every agency faces: when you've optimised for efficiency, how do you recognise you've optimised away the relationships that create real value? And why does the person who "knows a bit about a lot but not a lot about a bit" sometimes understand growth better than the technical experts?
The Client-First Transformation Blueprint:
The Painful Call Memory: Why experiencing terrible account management as a client created the blueprint for what not to do years later.
The First Answer Trap: How comfortable account managers ask questions "almost thinking we know the answer" and never delve deeper to find the real reason.
From 3% to 60%: How marketing services revenue transformed when conversations shifted from "do you want to buy this?" to "what do you want to achieve?"
The 20-Minute to 2-Hour Evolution: Why longer calls that frustrated account managers actually built the partnerships that drove growth.
Personal Brand as Business Asset: How wearing orange became instant recognition in the legal sector, making Dan identifiable before words were spoken.
The Imposter Syndrome Advantage: Why "knowing a bit about a lot" and empowering 40 specialists creates better results than trying to be the expert yourself.
Key Insights Uncovered:
Why most agencies understand client numbers and success metrics in "not enough detail" and fail to educate clients properly, that's the sector's dirty secret.
The two types of law firms: those using digital presence as "this is who we are" validation versus those actively generating work, and why strategy differs completely.
How the Covid culture shift at Conscious involved deep work on values, behaviours, and Simon Sinek's "why do we exist?" framework.
Why profitability is important but it's a result, not a focus, deliver the right service to the right people and money follows.
The philosophical principle: start with the end in mind, know where you're going before you begin, because you can't recognise success if you haven't defined it.
Why Dan wouldn't build an agency differently today (except the tech stack), the journey and lessons learned are the springboard for what's next.
The emotional honesty breakthrough: admitting "I suffer from imposter syndrome quite a bit" whilst leading 40 people creates more trust than pretending expertise.
The leadership insight from founder David: giving someone "enough rope to hang themselves" whilst trusting them to succeed, and how that rebuilt confidence after betrayal.
From Dan's perspective as someone parachuted into agency life from client-side consulting, witness how not knowing the technical details became competitive advantage. He didn't defend how things had always been done because he wasn't invested in the old way. He just remembered what it felt like to avoid those calls, and he made sure nobody would avoid his team's calls for the same reasons.
Dan shares the vulnerable moment that shaped everything: a business partner's betrayal, financial collapse, downgrading from Mercedes to ten-year-old Corsa, being scared to even call David for help. "They helped rebuild my confidence and rebuild me as a person, as a better version of who you see today." That emotional honesty, that willingness to show weakness, that's what makes him effective leading people.
This episode addresses the question every agency professional wrestles with: when you've been the client on painful calls, do you perpetuate the system or do you have the courage to change it? And why does the person who admits they don't know everything often build better teams than the person who pretends they do?
About Supo:
Supo provides people-first intelligence software for professional services firms, helping businesses maximise profit and motivate their people through powerful, AI-enabled business intelligence dashboards. By connecting over 500+ platforms and providing real-time data analysis, Supo helps firms make better data-driven decisions about their profit, projects, and people.
For more information about Supo: www.supo.co.uk
About Conscious:
Conscious has over 20 years of experience helping law firms become more successful online, working exclusively with law firms. Based in Bristol, the agency provides full-service digital marketing encompassing website design, SEO, PPC campaigns, digital PR, and ongoing optimisation. Their team consists of diverse individuals, from former law firm employees to marketing graduates, journalists, engineers, and apprentices who've progressed through the organisation. Their approach blends sophisticated technology with professionally written legal content, allowing law firms to choose services based on existing resources.
For more information about Conscious: www.conscious.co.uk
Ready to discover why the best agency transformations start with remembering what it felt like to be the client? This episode isn't just about changing calls, it's about having the courage to admit what doesn't work and the emotional honesty to rebuild it properly.